Yes, both, I have both. I think I mentioned previously that I’ve been lucky enough to have the benefit of a number of executive coaches. And one of my companies, I had a very close relationship with the CEO, we had worked together for a very, very long time, and I think we just had similar approaches to how we operated. And as the coach put it, that we both spoke Swahili, but we’re not very good at communicating to people who only spoke French.
And so, I would try to help others have a better relationship with the CEO by giving them feedback, saying, “I think it would be great if you did this and this, “and it was not very well received at all. And the coach gave me two specific examples, she would speak to me in terms that I can understand, which is like at that time I had young children, so it was always about childbirth.
So, she said, “okay, you Jan are at the kindergarten table, and you’ve got two kindergarteners next to you, and Ms. Sally comes by and says, Jan, your art is so beautiful, I’ve never seen anything so wonderful, and she walks away without saying a word to the other two children. And if I turn to them and say, well, if you use the crinkly scissors, Ms. Sally will like your art too.” And who are they going to be mad at? So, that to me was like, oh yes, of course they’re going to be mad at me, and not Ms. Sally. And so, that was eye opening to me, and she taught me the vampire defense, and…